Show #152 – Detox Series: Phase 2.5 detox with Dr Kelly Halderman


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And onto this week’s show!

Have you heard of phase 2.5 detox and the key role it plays in supporting the healthy removal of used hormones and toxins from our system? Dr Kelly Halderman explains what it is and why it is so key – especially for people who live or work in high tox environments or who have detoxification impairment due to illness or (epi)genetics.

We also talk about the full detoxification picture, how to optimise detoxification, links between poor detoxification, chronic illness, gall bladder issues, and resistant weight loss. 

The framework for my discussion with Kelly:


  • Detoxing with the help of your internet: What are some of the pitfalls you’re seeing in the way people are self-diagnosing and treating when it comes to a need for detox? 

Detoxing overview – so let’s talk: 

  • Phase 1 purpose/function/pitfalls
  • Phase 2 “      “ “ 
  • Phase 2.5 – you coined an extra lil’ guy here: Talk us through it. 
  • Phase 3 

There are some things that “shut the 2.5 door”

  • Inflammation: There are standard markers that could tell us if our 2.5 door is potentially closed or not, but sometimes inflammation shows up in other places / those markers could be ‘normal’. 
  • Gut
  • Bad Estrogen (Carrie’s been on the show twice so feel free to talk Dutch test, our listeners are up with it) 
  • Resistant weight loss: There’s a link, right? 
  • How is the best way to get a clear picture of what our detox pathways are doing in our own bodies? Are there particular symptoms that go with each of the phases that give us a clue as to which phase we need the most support in? 
  • What are some of your favourite protocols/lifestyle tweaks that help us move the needle on that 2.5? 
  • Let’s talk bile/thyroid connection. How do we get our Docs to routinely test T3/4 RT3/antibodies instead of TSH and “your thyroid’s normal”? Is there a document / patient hand out you have to help patients feel they have the medical research support to justify the additional tests?
  • And all this liberation of toxins and moving them out – we want to make sure they’re headed OUT – can we talk about binders as it’s a bit of a minefield as to what to use out there.


Top takeaways from the show:

1. Phase 1 of detoxification takes toxins to the liver and makes them more reactive.

2. Phase 2 of detoxification then takes the toxins, puts them through glucuronidation, amino acid conjugation, glutathione and sulfation, and methylation, which makes them water soluble.

3. These water soluble toxins include indigenous toxicant such as old thyroid hormones or fat soluble vitamins, histamine, xenobiotics, and exobiotics, that can be toxins, heavy metals, and other things that need to get out.

4. When Phase 2 toxins are ready, they enter the bile, which sends them to the GI tract for expulsion.

5. Detox 2.5 is the door that toxins go through to get into the bile.

6. If the Detox 2.5 door is shut down due to inflammation, toxins will re-enter your bloodstream, causing fatigue, brain fog and other symptoms depending on the individual.

7. When beginning the process of detoxification with her patients Dr. Halderman first starts by looking at the sources of inflammation, whether it is physical, chemical, emotional or microbial.

8. Phase 2.5 involves three things; toxins moving into the bile, the bile salt moving into the bile, and putting more phosphocholine into the body.

9. Dr. Halderman recommends Sulforaphane, bitters, and artichokes to help stabilize the transporter so the bile salts will get out.

10. Dr. Halderman is a big fan of restricted eating, giving your gut a break by inducing autophagy which helps open the 2.5 door.

11. Taking binders is extremely important when beginning a detox protocol and to know which ones to take it’s best to work with an experienced naturopath or integrative GP in your area.


Other helpful links:

To know more about Kelly and her supplements, check out:

Follow Kelly on Instagram @nutraceuticalformulators or on Facebook



Enjoy the show and thanks again for taking the time to rate and review the show on your app – it’s like tipping the bartender and it means the world.

Low Tox. Happy us. Happy planet

Comments 7

  1. Oh golly – so the show notes don’t actually deliver what was promised in the pod. I was really looking forward to the supplementary materials Kelly mentioned.

    She suggested that she couldn’t ‘go in depth’ because of the time constraint of a ‘podcast’, and had specific notes. They aren’t here!

    I love all this new leading edge stuff, but its useless to me. You say that ‘self diagnosis’ is bad – whilst not really giving us information that we can easily access and/or utilise. This pod, in particular, is such a narrow focus.

    Interesting, sure – but useful – not so much. 🙁

    Who, in Australia, has ever heard of 2.5? Who treats it? More please!!!!!

    1. Post

      Hi Kelly

      I’m sorry you felt that way about the show being too narrow. Did you listen to last week’s – it’s a 3 week series and Naomi’s basics really help frame the deeper dive this week. As for the follow up notes that’s completely my fault. the day I recorded Kelly’s interview was my son’s birthday and a million things happening that day led to me forgetting to add them to our central doc for the VA to put together. They’ll be up tomorrow evening for you, Alexx. Any time in the future maybe just ask “hey did you guys forget to upload what Alexx talked about in the show?” and we’ll hop to it. A strentched small team and sometimes things fall by the wayside. x

      1. Hi Alexx,

        I’d also love some info on a specific brand of supplements for the Phase 2.5 detox that was mentioned as well as the molecular hydrogen, the binders and the phosphorus coleine (sorry not sure of the spelling).
        I’ve done a quick google but nothing particular came and even on her website she only links to another supplement company?

        Many thanks this conversation really opened up a whole new world for me!


  2. Enjoyed this show very much. Are there any practitioners in Brisbane who have 2.5 in their repertoire?
    If not where can I get more info on 2.5?
    Many thanks

  3. Hi Alex, I was wondering if you have any idea how a listener could try Kellie’s products? I looked them up and understandably they are a Practitioner only brand. Are you aware of any stockists in Australia ? Do you think you would have to get your own integrative Dr to stock them? Thank you for providing this valuable information
    Kind regards

  4. hey did you guys forget to upload what Alexx talked about in the show?

    Years later and I’m still trying to find what to print to take to my doctor… Should we suspect a conspiracy is keeping the information from us…?

    Any help much appreciated!

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